FFXII character notes, preliminary
Dec. 30th, 2006 10:33 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
petroniaToo under the weather to go out so staying home and gaming, but sororial unit is still at the piano so I'm writing an LJ entry instead. :P In any case I am wending my way toward certain tombs and very iya da about it. With Vagrant Story I would drag my feet when in the overcity unwilling to go back downstairs because overcity Lea Monde is a sleepy little medieval French town that is lovely to wander through, even if it is overrun with the Cardinal's men trying to stick you with pointy objects. Now that I have a proper world map and blue desert skies at my disposal I am doubly IYA DAAAA.
Okay anyhow this is the FFXII-to-date post. I'll start with the characters and hope I'll remember everything else I wanted to say as I go along. :P
Vaan: is not very interesting compared to everyone else. XD He's not really annoying, either - basically he's well-characterized for what he is, i.e. random Rabanastre street kid A. Luke Skywalker, only one doesn't get the sense the plot is going to end up revolving around him. I was just talking with sororial unit who said she thought Vaan existed because the story needed a "main character", by which I think she meant the kind of protagonist easily identifiable as the 15-year-old male target audience placeholder, but Vaan's role feels more complex than that to me. The characters themselves talk about meddling gods, who by all indications have a heavy sense of irony; Vaan is something like the invisible fulcrum of fate, or the pebble that sets off an avalanche. He's there at the right/wrong place at the right/wrong time to bring people and objects together, and then the Cycle turns (in Brust's parlance). Which makes it ironic that Vaan's personal growth is all about struggling against feelings of disenfranchisement, of being victimized by political forces beyond his control.
Penelo: arguably the most random presence in the party, since she's only there because Vaan is, and Vaan's excuse for being there is fairly spurious to begin with. XD I really like Penelo, though, she's just a... likeable person? As opposed to Fran and Ashe, both of whom are forbidding in their own ways. And she's not naive or flaky the way "white mage" type characters can stereotypically be.
The game is not doing the cute het romance drama thing at all - not in the way VIII through X did - on the personal-to-political scale it is tipped way toward the political end. I'm not bothering to rate but if I were Vaan/Penelo would be a C=4 based on the fact that Balthier assumes they're a couple, but Vaan himself is adamant Penelo is just a friend. XD; Apparently this causes my brain to stop the perceived gap by making up het romance ships on its own. WHAT THE HELL, BRAIN. Not to mention the pairings are all obviously D-O-O-M-E-D. I have actually constructed this whole thing about Ashe's childhood and how she wanted to wield a sword like her brothers and didn't want to get married but Rasler won her heart anyway but I am waaaaaaaaaaay too embarrassed to contemplate writing it.
I sort of also like Larsa/Penelo because there is something very David Eddings about it (...in a good way) but that is doomed too because she wouldn't pick him, she'd pick Vaan and they'd run away and be pirates. I HAVE SEEN THIS MOVIE.
Balthier and Fran: okay I wonder about Balthier (I keep spelling him as "blather", insert own punchline) because um everyone questions his piratical loyalties but no one ever questions why he has an Arcadian noble accent? Or is it just me? XD;; I mean, I guess the Japanese version didn't have accents and that was just Alexander O. Smith being cleverpants.
As anyone who plays the game can't help noticing, Balthier and Fran are basically Han Solo and Chewbacca, except instead of being tall, furry and meaningfully silent, Fran is oh wait. They have that True Partners thing going, you can tell because the dialogue is always mysteriously more awesome and quotable if the conversation contains both Balthier and Fran as opposed to just one of them.
(Yes, it is Star Wars, except 1) there's nothing wrong with that, it's like complaining a story is actually Shakespeare, 2) I do not think Vaan and Ashe will turn out to be related, 3) I doubly do not think Balthier and Ashe will get together AAHH THE THOUGHT ITSELF IS SPORKWORTHY, 4) there is no Obi Wan Kenobi. Maybe Vaan will turn out to be related to a Judge but I doubt it. ...Actually the last items are all pretty much accounted for by pointing to Basch.)
Basch and Gabranth: I feel the need to lodge a complaint regarding the character names. It's not that I think they're bad, they just have a knack of provoking inappropriate hilarity (in me). Marquis of Ondore? Gabranth? Solidor? Zargabaath? Like bleeding Michael Moorcock is what it is.
Anyhow the more this game progresses the more one realises that Basch and Gabranth are like one of those case studies about twins who were raised apart and when notes are compared it turns out they're in the same profession and have the same number of kids and participated in the same club activities in high school, only on opposite coasts. Or in Gabranth and Basch's particular case, on opposite sides of a war. Uh... sucks to be them? XD; I made sororial unit wail at me because she loves Gabranth and I said I'd eat my hat if he survived past the end of the game. Not that I don't like him either but he'd have to develop a consumptive cough to be more doomed than he is.
Am I the only one who thought the story would be more interesting if Basch really were the one who flipped and killed King Raminas? XD;;; Then again the plot device is so retarded it went beyond retarded into the terrain of possibly awesome. I like how Vaan was like "I, I don't believe you!" and Balthier was like "I do," and as usual Balthier was right because you could believe Basch had done it but you couldn't believe Basch would make up a story along the lines of It Wasn't Me It Was My Evil Twin.
Ashe: the most interesting Final Fantasy heroine since Celes, although not the most likeable. The beauty of it is that she's not supposed to be likeable. Likeability is not on her agenda. Even better - she's not at all pretty. That is I thought she was pretty when I first saw the concept art but in-game she's not. She's pale and her eyes burn, there's no colour to her lips. She's a very angry person with a sword and that's what you notice first.
The story is Ashe's story, but it couldn't have been told from Ashe's point of view, because paradoxically that would have made it too narrow in scope.
Vayne: I am greatly enjoying hating Vayne. XD I hated Seymour in the last one but Vayne is a worthy opponent (FFX was in a way a story without a true villain). When I first played FFVII I was unironically terrified of Sephiroth, there is not much one can really say about Ultimecia, and I didn't hate Kuja - I loved him for being fabulously fabulous. XD Vayne on the other hand... I could work up a tidy bit of hateful rhapsody just on the topic of his hair.
...These character notes seem to get more flippant the further I get down the list. ^^; O and I am incubating one of my inevitable Invisible City Postcards about Ashley Riot at the Muthru Bazaar. Because empires and religions rise and fall, but bazaars last forever.
Okay anyhow this is the FFXII-to-date post. I'll start with the characters and hope I'll remember everything else I wanted to say as I go along. :P
Vaan: is not very interesting compared to everyone else. XD He's not really annoying, either - basically he's well-characterized for what he is, i.e. random Rabanastre street kid A. Luke Skywalker, only one doesn't get the sense the plot is going to end up revolving around him. I was just talking with sororial unit who said she thought Vaan existed because the story needed a "main character", by which I think she meant the kind of protagonist easily identifiable as the 15-year-old male target audience placeholder, but Vaan's role feels more complex than that to me. The characters themselves talk about meddling gods, who by all indications have a heavy sense of irony; Vaan is something like the invisible fulcrum of fate, or the pebble that sets off an avalanche. He's there at the right/wrong place at the right/wrong time to bring people and objects together, and then the Cycle turns (in Brust's parlance). Which makes it ironic that Vaan's personal growth is all about struggling against feelings of disenfranchisement, of being victimized by political forces beyond his control.
Penelo: arguably the most random presence in the party, since she's only there because Vaan is, and Vaan's excuse for being there is fairly spurious to begin with. XD I really like Penelo, though, she's just a... likeable person? As opposed to Fran and Ashe, both of whom are forbidding in their own ways. And she's not naive or flaky the way "white mage" type characters can stereotypically be.
The game is not doing the cute het romance drama thing at all - not in the way VIII through X did - on the personal-to-political scale it is tipped way toward the political end. I'm not bothering to rate but if I were Vaan/Penelo would be a C=4 based on the fact that Balthier assumes they're a couple, but Vaan himself is adamant Penelo is just a friend. XD; Apparently this causes my brain to stop the perceived gap by making up het romance ships on its own. WHAT THE HELL, BRAIN. Not to mention the pairings are all obviously D-O-O-M-E-D. I have actually constructed this whole thing about Ashe's childhood and how she wanted to wield a sword like her brothers and didn't want to get married but Rasler won her heart anyway but I am waaaaaaaaaaay too embarrassed to contemplate writing it.
I sort of also like Larsa/Penelo because there is something very David Eddings about it (...in a good way) but that is doomed too because she wouldn't pick him, she'd pick Vaan and they'd run away and be pirates. I HAVE SEEN THIS MOVIE.
Balthier and Fran: okay I wonder about Balthier (I keep spelling him as "blather", insert own punchline) because um everyone questions his piratical loyalties but no one ever questions why he has an Arcadian noble accent? Or is it just me? XD;; I mean, I guess the Japanese version didn't have accents and that was just Alexander O. Smith being cleverpants.
As anyone who plays the game can't help noticing, Balthier and Fran are basically Han Solo and Chewbacca, except instead of being tall, furry and meaningfully silent, Fran is oh wait. They have that True Partners thing going, you can tell because the dialogue is always mysteriously more awesome and quotable if the conversation contains both Balthier and Fran as opposed to just one of them.
(Yes, it is Star Wars, except 1) there's nothing wrong with that, it's like complaining a story is actually Shakespeare, 2) I do not think Vaan and Ashe will turn out to be related, 3) I doubly do not think Balthier and Ashe will get together AAHH THE THOUGHT ITSELF IS SPORKWORTHY, 4) there is no Obi Wan Kenobi. Maybe Vaan will turn out to be related to a Judge but I doubt it. ...Actually the last items are all pretty much accounted for by pointing to Basch.)
Basch and Gabranth: I feel the need to lodge a complaint regarding the character names. It's not that I think they're bad, they just have a knack of provoking inappropriate hilarity (in me). Marquis of Ondore? Gabranth? Solidor? Zargabaath? Like bleeding Michael Moorcock is what it is.
Anyhow the more this game progresses the more one realises that Basch and Gabranth are like one of those case studies about twins who were raised apart and when notes are compared it turns out they're in the same profession and have the same number of kids and participated in the same club activities in high school, only on opposite coasts. Or in Gabranth and Basch's particular case, on opposite sides of a war. Uh... sucks to be them? XD; I made sororial unit wail at me because she loves Gabranth and I said I'd eat my hat if he survived past the end of the game. Not that I don't like him either but he'd have to develop a consumptive cough to be more doomed than he is.
Am I the only one who thought the story would be more interesting if Basch really were the one who flipped and killed King Raminas? XD;;; Then again the plot device is so retarded it went beyond retarded into the terrain of possibly awesome. I like how Vaan was like "I, I don't believe you!" and Balthier was like "I do," and as usual Balthier was right because you could believe Basch had done it but you couldn't believe Basch would make up a story along the lines of It Wasn't Me It Was My Evil Twin.
Ashe: the most interesting Final Fantasy heroine since Celes, although not the most likeable. The beauty of it is that she's not supposed to be likeable. Likeability is not on her agenda. Even better - she's not at all pretty. That is I thought she was pretty when I first saw the concept art but in-game she's not. She's pale and her eyes burn, there's no colour to her lips. She's a very angry person with a sword and that's what you notice first.
The story is Ashe's story, but it couldn't have been told from Ashe's point of view, because paradoxically that would have made it too narrow in scope.
Vayne: I am greatly enjoying hating Vayne. XD I hated Seymour in the last one but Vayne is a worthy opponent (FFX was in a way a story without a true villain). When I first played FFVII I was unironically terrified of Sephiroth, there is not much one can really say about Ultimecia, and I didn't hate Kuja - I loved him for being fabulously fabulous. XD Vayne on the other hand... I could work up a tidy bit of hateful rhapsody just on the topic of his hair.
...These character notes seem to get more flippant the further I get down the list. ^^; O and I am incubating one of my inevitable Invisible City Postcards about Ashley Riot at the Muthru Bazaar. Because empires and religions rise and fall, but bazaars last forever.
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no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 04:15 am (UTC)XII's story is unique for FF because it's not quite RAGTAG GROUP OF HEROES TRYING TO SAVE THE WORLD for once, I mean the elements are all there but the agenda is a lot more practical. And even though they save a country rather than the entire world in a concrete sense, the world-saving satisfaction of putting an end to a HUGE territorial conflict is still present. The 6 main characters can be divided into three pairs, each with its own perception of the same story, and really it's Ashe and Basch who end up on the key end of the storyline, with Balthier sort of figuring in it somewhere, and Fran figuring in it insofar as Balthier does. Vaan and Penelo's roles do feel tacked on, and without them in the picture the ragtag factor vanishes almost entirely, they're not even there in the way Fran is, Vaan just says something about FINDING HIS COMING OF AGE STORY or whatever, but the pair of them is necessary as well, because without Vaan and Penelo you have four heavily complex characters whose roles are a lot harder to tap into than that of a fifteen-year-old boy. There's something to be said, too, RE: need for an arguably "objective" outlook at this huge world-turning event catalyzed by vars. mature and complicated people.
Your comments about Ashe are so true, WOW, and though I never noticed how UNPRETTY Ashe is actually meant to be (blame the tube skirt), I always admired the way her role fits nicely into the tried-and-true archetype of THE LOST PRINCE FIGHTING TO RECLAIM HIS THRONE. I love that every knight-type Ashe meets swears to keep her safe, to which she responds with FINE THEN KEEP ME SAFE WHILE I WIN BACK MY RULING RIGHT. This is not a negotiation.
Actually Ashe is pretty crazy when examined objectively, I mean who comes to the conclusion that STEALING A SHIP SHE CAN'T PILOT TO VISIT A MYTHICAL TOMB AT THE END OF THE WORLD is the best idea ever? I bet she snapped after Rasler died and her country was overrun by
British Imperialistsunscrupulous colonizers. Started a rebellion. No one had the nerve to say No Wait until she met Vaan, who never quite gets over his initial perception of Ashe as Girl In Distress, and struggles to understand why the chick he so gallantly saved is now telling him to Shut Up Because Children Do Not Belong In the Conversation. My favorite bit is the part after the Leviathan Fiasco, where Ashe is considering the nethicite shard in Very Serious Fashion, and Vaan chimes in with "Do you even know how to use it?" And everyone gets sort of quiet.no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:18 pm (UTC)Ashe is totally nuts and has good reason to be. ^^;
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:58 pm (UTC)THE GONDOR TWINS, BUT BACKWARDS
EXCEPT EVERYTHING IS SET IN TURKEY WITH LIKE CAMELFAX AND SHIT
The Star Wars crossover crap in there, Han and Chewie and the Kessel Run etc., makes this story HEAVILY APPEALING ON ALL FRONTS. They've covered their fantasy AND scifi crowd pull. QED.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-03 05:10 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 04:19 am (UTC)M, wanders away, whistling.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:20 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 04:25 am (UTC)YES EXACTLY.
Btw, the game stops being Star Wars nearly so much after Bhujerba, except that Gabranth never stops being Darth Vader, to the point where my laughing at that fact was actively disruptive to several serious late-game scenes.
I held the same opinion about his doomedness all the way up to the point where I found out whether I was correct.
The story is Ashe's story,
I actually kind of think that Basch is the 'real' protagonist of the game, which is not just my blatant character favoritism (to a really unusual degree for me, I think) talking, since Basch's story is by rights also Gabranth's story, and the way the game plays out (and especially the focus of game end and the epilogue) holds that idea up pretty well. (Also I kind of went '!!!' when I realized that the actual game logo is Gabranth... which from what I can tell seems very Matsuno-like, even if I don't have Tactics for comparison.)
Ashe has a lot of development through the course of the plot -- she probably grows the most, even though all the characters in the main party get their chance to address their issues in various direct or more subtle ways as the story progresses -- but her part in the story, and her resolution, is mostly exactly what you expect it to be. She's part of the larger, whole-world-level story. The twins' story feels like the central personal story to me.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 06:58 pm (UTC)Wow, I hadn't realised that. :o
Ashe has a lot of development through the course of the plot -- she probably grows the most, even though all the characters in the main party get their chance to address their issues in various direct or more subtle ways as the story progresses -- but her part in the story, and her resolution, is mostly exactly what you expect it to be. She's part of the larger, whole-world-level story.
I think you are right although I'm going to stop posting about this game until I get somewhat further in the story at least. XD
no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 05:15 am (UTC)As anyone who plays the game can't help noticing, Balthier and Fran are basically Han Solo and Chewbacca, except instead of being tall, furry and meaningfully silent, Fran is oh wait. They have that True Partners thing going, you can tell because the dialogue is always mysteriously more awesome and quotable if the conversation contains both Balthier and Fran as opposed to just one of them.
Let's see if I can apply the formula without having played the game, but based on what little I know of the characters from other sources.
C (canonicity) = 4 or 5.
M (Moe) = 2 (may be higher; you didn't give a good scale for this)
P (personality)= 4 or 5.
W (wank potential) = 1 or 2.
Using the least favorable values, PP=4+2+2-0.6=7.4
Using the most favorable values, PP=5+2+2.5-0.3=9.2
Did I get the values right? Did I use the equation correctly? Is the outcome reasonable?
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 06:01 pm (UTC)I would rank Balthier/Fran C=3 at the moment (I haven't played through the entire thing), M=4 (it seems to be a popular pairing in the fandom - this is fairly subjective though), P=4 or 5, W=1. But yes, you're using the equations correctly, fwtw. *g*
Probably to get defensible data one should make a community poll and take the median, though I'd have to stress M is based on one's perception of the fandom at large and not just simply what oneself likes.
no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 05:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 06:02 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 05:55 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:00 pm (UTC)I have more to say but in all decency I should, uh, get through this damned tomb first.
no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 06:13 am (UTC)It's an impressive game. During the whole ride, I was raving about how I'd fork out $120 for a PS2 just to play this game.
For the one minute and a half of exposure to Vaan, I think that he's a lot like Zidane, with that carefree and playful teenager attitude. Yeah.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 06:07 pm (UTC)Well, now that you've made good on your promise, blog about how you find it. XD
no subject
Date: 2006-12-31 08:29 am (UTC)I've never actually played a game that was so focused on politics before FFXII (even though I own Tactics), but I am finding that I am enjoying it greatly.
Vaan is an idiot. Half of me is convinced that he is there for comic relief, though he's not actually at the butt of the jokes.
Penelo. I have this mental image of Vaan being all like "Hey Penelope," (pronounced like antelope) and Penelo throwing shit at him. And I agree with you about Penelo, she's very likeable, as opposed to Ashe, who akes sandpaper seem soft, and Fran who appears very cold and aloof. She is just you average everyday girl who gets kidnapped, then is rescued by being kidnapped again in a very gentlemanly fashion.
Though thinking about their placement in the party, I think perhaps Vaan and Penelo serve as a reality check for the others. Like, they ARE the modern day Rabenastre citizen; they are the future! ...though in Vaan's case, that might worry some people.
Basch... oh Basch. I am not quite sure why I like him so much. Perhaps it is because he is basically the game's whore. You, litterally, could pair him with anyone (which is fun for me, since I like do more character focused pieces), and have it make at least some for of sense. ...Okay, almost anyone. It wouldn;'t work with Ashe, because he is her Knight (whether she likes it or not), and it would be improper for him to court her. Also, he's like a well trained, highly armed puppy. Every time Ashe yells at him, he gets this hurt look on his face and the rest of the group is like "...geez, what a bitch." Even Vaan (who spent a good deal of time yelling at Basch himself), which I find so hysterical. Though I am disappointed in Gabranth. I mean, what decent evil twin doesn't have a sinister mustache and eye patch? Seriously. It makes you wonder, though, did King Raminas know that Gabranth wasn't Basch?
Balthier is also amusing. The very first thing I thought of was how much like Han Solo he really was, though I doubt he and Ashe would make a good couple. He actually reminds me of a mix between Jack Sparrow and Han Solo. "Pirate."
Fran is... uhh... other than eye candy with a cute accent? I like her, but I have a hard time pinning her down decently, character-wise. perhaps I am just distracted by the legs and the ears and the accent?
As far as Ashe goes, I can sympathize with her. She's young, her husband has been murdered and she has been stripped of her throne. She is bitter, angry, and God help anyone who gets in her way of getting back what is rightfully hers. I also like how she isn't very attractive. I mean, like, she is pretty, but she would have to work at it, and, really, you can tell she doesn't care about her physical appearance. Her main concern is not how she looks, but about her country.
That, and she is a total hardass.
...I'd babble more about the other characters, but it's late and I should probably get some sleep.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 07:27 pm (UTC)I think the Fran-Balthier dynamic is sort of,
Balthier: *swaggers and is witty*
Fran: *conveys sarcasm without even speaking*
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 08:04 pm (UTC)Larsa, on the other hand, is just bossy. XD!
but yeah, I love the dynamic between Balthier and Fran. I love that it's not at all like "Oh, they're sleeping together," though it could totally be like that ((actually, I have this mental image that they share Balthier's "conquests". Is that just me?)), but it's so obvious that they are important to each other.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 08:19 pm (UTC)Also he goes on to lead his Loyal Rabanastre Streetrat Crew in a Sky-Pirating adventure! I imagine it takes brains to not die while doing so.
no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 09:02 pm (UTC)and he didn't really accept Basch's story until later, though I would've been suspicious if Vaan was all "Oh, you didn't kill him? Well then, join our merry band of thieves and we will free the country together! :D" because, uh, dude, for two years Vaan was convinced this guy not only killed their king, but his brother too. But he totally was nice to him after he saw how Ashe treated him, and I have this horrible mental imge of Vaan, at the end of the game, going up to Basch and being like "I'm adopting you." and Basch is all "...Wait, what?"
no subject
Date: 2007-01-01 05:09 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-01-02 06:04 pm (UTC)Heck, I wish I hadn't held out til December, because right now everyone is writing fic and not reading until I beat the game is like roasting in fangirl hell. XD
no subject
Date: 2007-01-03 05:02 am (UTC)Hahah, I knew what I was heading for when I spurned FFXII for Tales of the Abyss, and I don't have the patience to keep myself un-spoiled til May - this game is so, so juicy and lends itself so readily to all sorts of crack without being crazy in the head itself. (I choose you, FFVII!) Heck, I didn't even have the patience to wait 100 hours and beat the game before spoiling myself for Abyss. XD;;
Fic-wise... the only vaguely consolatory thing I can think of is, it doesn't take that long to beat the game and you must be close to it now? :D;; The very prospect of brilliant fic is unfortunately alien to most of the fandoms I've been in the past year, but at least there's yummy (http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/endou3/abisu.kiss20.1.htm) art (http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/endou3/abisu.kiss20.2.htm).