While I'm at it (slightly more substantial TeniPuri babble)

[petronia]

Copying over the last chunk of my discussion with ayatsujik, so as not to clutter up the comment thread of the Christmas jpop post more than I already have. ^^;



I did want to pin down some of my nebulous ideas on what the A vs. T match signified, because none of the fic that's out there really... does it for me. Not in a they're-badly-written sense, but a you're-not-reading-things-the-same-way-I-do sense. Taken as a collectivity there seems to be a sentiment in said stories that Tezuka made Atobe "see the light" somehow; taught him something about ethics or honour or generally being a mensch. And that wasn't what I understood from that scene in the manga. The Seigaku reg'rs, now, may have learnt something about honour from Tezuka, but what I saw was that Atobe's opinion of Tezuka changed, not so much that any illumination was shed on his own behaviour. ^^; It comes down, in fact, to the Dangerous Liaisons metaphor I used in the Fuji story: Atobe wasn't so much deliberately trying to hurt Tezuka as maneuvre him into a no-win situation, expecting him to give up and to be able to lord it over him afterward - and Tezuka literally chose to self-destruct rather than concede a loss. Upon which Atobe was like, holy shit, props to you for being an insane fuck under that two-foot-thick layer of repressive holier-than-thou buchou-hood, you are now someone I find interesting as opposed to annoying. XD;; And pays him the tribute of not cutting him a millimeter of slack.

So if it's anything that Tezuka shows Atobe, it's that there's a step beyond the Perfect Game. That if you think all your bases are covered and you're giving it everything you have... you're probably not, because you're still thinking. *g* At some point it becomes not a question of talent or strategy, both of which Atobe has in spades and relies on, but of heart. And insanity.

What interests me about it is what it says about Atobe's character, that he should dislike someone for a perceived lack of passion. Which is fair enough, by the by, given that all the reader gets to see up to this point is Tezuka's icily perfect exterior. Sure, you grok that he's determined, but you don't grok that he's ever been at a loss in his entire life. The laps and Tezuka Zone have the same metaphoric value: Tezuka picks his spot and makes other people run. XD He beats Ryouma without breaking a sweat. Someone like that, it's hard not to harbour the secret desire to take him down a notch. The Seigaku regulars would follow Tezuka to the gates of hell, but even they're half-hoping for the day Buchou gets roped into drinking Inui's juice. ^^;

So Atobe, really, has to play Tezuka in person to catch a glimpse at the fire that half his own team probably doesn't think exists. I mean, Ooishi knows, obviously. Fuji knows - that comment he makes right before he tears Mizuki a new one. (Is Tezuka's blood up? Well, he's very sorry, but Fuji will be the one to hammer the nail into St-R's coffin. Which at that point was like Inui's line re how Kaidou's in a good mood today - "How can you tell!?") Ryuzaki-sensei likely knows, and that's it. Everyone else is just like, well, Buchou is Buchou, and the day Buchou loses his calm frogs will rain down from the sky.


Note that I'm still not there in the anime >_>, but I don't think there's any vast difference. Except for them apparently changing Atobe's hair colour. (P.S. I'll fic if I come up with a plot that isn't the sort of plot that causes people to say relationships don't constitute plot, if you see what I mean. And oh yes the Karupin bit was incredibly ky00t, but that's precisely it. Kaidou being ky00t auuuggghhh colour me disturbed. XD;;)

Comments

[ayatsujik.livejournal.com]

Right, I get you on Kaidou. As in, it would have been interesting/nice/fun to have a character who's *really* not a big stinking teddy bear under his five-foot Wall of Weird? XD

And yay, you posted! Mind if I reproduce this is reply to a thread that's going on (http://www.livejournal.com/users/tormalyne/55090.html) here? Have a look-see yourself.

[petronia.livejournal.com]

Oh, I gave up on that after the Karupin episode, and a good thing too - it was still relatively early on. XD (And it was more a sort of, "...Dude, you are really a h00j uke, aren't you?" o_O; reaction.)

I guess Akutsu at least isn't secretly a big scooshy marshmallow? XD Well, not insofar as we get to see, though he hasn't actually killed Taka for being nice to him so one never knows.

(Sure, reproduce as much as you like. ^_^ Hmm... I do see where someone who's an Atobe fan first would find the current fanon for said pairing awfully annoying. But then I'm secure in the fact that that's not how I see the dynamic in the first place. XD)

[aerie.livejournal.com]

I guess Akutsu at least isn't secretly a big scooshy marshmallow? XD Well, not insofar as we get to see, though he hasn't actually killed Taka for being nice to him so one never knows.
Or Taichi! Akutsu was actually pretty nice to Taichi, comparatively anyway. Taichi's what, four feet tall? and wasn't the slightest bit afraid of him, even argued with him.

pardon me, am newly fangirl, thus prone to enthusiastic babbling. I just watched the Atobe/Tezuka match a few days ago, and actually read it much the same way. Atobe had been expecting Tezuka to eventually give in, but Tezuka turned out to be passionate in a wholly irrational way.. and, well, that's a surprise. The new respect/appreciation it effects in him is part of the reason I find Atobe an appealing character. (There was a similar situation in how he handled Shishido. Shishido showed he was devoted enough to lop off all his hair and be pelted by tennis balls all night. Atobe can get behind that. (X) ..Alas, Tezuka still rather bores me so far.

[worldserpent.livejournal.com]

Heh. Another victim of PoT....

Yeah, that's a point in Atobe's favor, how he backed up Shishido. (Still think the coach's policy is really stupid. What, he thinks teenage boys *like* losing?)

As for Tezuka...well, if you're there in the series, you won't have to be bored anymore... Not that I dislike Tezuka, or don't find him interesting, I just have trouble fangirling him because he's so distant and mature. But actually my taste in characters that I fangirl is terrible, because I tend to like the ones that you're supposed to love to hate.

[beckymarie.livejournal.com]

Ahhh, I just wanted to say thank you for this post because, despite the volumes I've practically written on the subject of this match, I've never been able to find these words. (Close, but always a little off. Which frustrates me to no end, since it's my favorite match in the series.)

*rabus madly*

[petronia.livejournal.com]

But actually my taste in characters that I fangirl is terrible, because I tend to like the ones that you're supposed to love to hate.

Wouldn't that be, like, Mizuki and Akutsu? XD

[petronia.livejournal.com]

You're welcome. And I'm incredibly impressed by how much you manage to accomplish for the fandom, by the by (oh whottheheck - *friends* XD).

[worldserpent.livejournal.com]

Hey, but I do like Mizuki and Akutsu! Well, in a weird way, but I noticed I posted more on them than I did than about say, I don't know, Momo. Of course, that post was denouncing them, but after awhile you start to feel dishonest and you realize that who ever gets the most screentime in your blog/essays (fanfic-novel-video game-whatever), must in some form be liked by yourself. I mean, some goody-two-shoes may be the moral center, yadda yadda, but if we don't seem to care much about the moral center anyway, that tells you something. (The latter sentence doesn't really apply to PoT. PoT isn't really about morality and the titanic battle between Good Vs. Evil, which is what makes the series so fun, to I who am not into sports series.... BTW, how do sports series of this type end, out of curiosity? I don't know because I don't follow many...)

[petronia.livejournal.com]

The same way as other Neverending Shounen Jump Tournaments end: with your guys losing after some respectable showing, and then two years later they get a scholarship to play junior soccer in Italy or something. (No, wait, that was Zetsuai...) Rather, it ends when the mangaka decides he's had enough, or falls out with the editor or ruins his drawing hand irreparably and has to go to Germany to get an operation. *g*

If the mangaka is devoted enough, they win the Cup. (And then come back after some years for more, à la Captain Tsubasa.)

I totally admit to loving to hate Mizuki, because the kind of outrage he provokes in me is so rare (I mean I don't get outraged at Big Baddies like Sephiroth, yanno) that it automatically elevates the character to "like" on a meta level. Akutsu makes me giggle, but that's because Slam Dunk had a zillion characters that were just as delinquent, so I'm used to the misbehaviour.

[worldserpent.livejournal.com]

Whaat? But how can tournaments be never ending? No matter how this tournament ends, the next one *is* going to be Nationals, and I'd think that the fangirl machine is good enough to get us through four other teams composed of biseinen/bishounen. (Personally, I think only Ryouma is going to turn pro. Tezuka is too into being buchou to go into the individualism of pro tennis. He's going to become a high level manager type of some sort. Inui is so going to become a MD/Ph.D. Oishi, definitely a doctor of the fuzzy sort. The rest, don't know. )

Mizuki: sort of the same, except that I <3 his seiyuu. I'm shallow that way... With me character liking is highly predicated on meta-liking, because I'm not that imaginative. Only meta-liking can really make me create shrines or higher forms of fannish devotion, I'm afraid.

[petronia.livejournal.com]

I just call Jump series Neverending Sports/Fighting Tournaments because that's what they mostly seem to be; or if they don't begin that way (ex. YYH, Kenshin, Bleach), they'll at least end up that way. Hopefully Konomi's devoted enough to get his heros to the National finals. *g* It's about time he started a Part II, anyway, given that he's run out of foreshadowing. (Classically, the beginning of Part II is when you get off-court intros to the important national characters, or - in the case of HikaGo - international. Of course HikaGo didn't make good on so much as a third of it, but then neither did Slam Dunk.)

Tezuka: damned if I know. Mangaka tend to turn characters like that into doctors. Maybe he'll end up in the Diet. XD

Inui: whoo, here comes the double Ph.D. in Chemistry and Pharmacology!

Fuji likes photography, so I fancy him becoming a professional blackmailer photographer. Not that this provides me with greater opportunity for pretentious!referential!ficbunnies, of course.